Brake fluid - ate superblue

[mrslysly]

I have 1/2 litre of just opened superblue and need to do a fluid flush on my vette. Used the other 1/2 of the can to do Blaqks car. Anyone have any unopened bottle(s) I can buy from them?

Or anyone have some other high temp brake fluid that I could purchase? If not might turn this into a group buy.

[EVILUTION]

I have some Motul 600 if you need some. $17.50 each.

I have 4 available.

[mrslysly]

I have some Motul 600 if you need some. $17.50 each.

I have 4 available.

Plastic bottles? How long has it sat?

[EVILUTION]

I hope you're kidding about the plastic bottle comment... LOL that talk is gizmm-gibberish.

Either way I purchased this from the EVOM brake guru in April.

[mrslysly]

I hope you're kidding about the plastic bottle comment... LOL that talk is gizmm-gibberish.



I'm not. Plastic is a porous material that water will penetrate over a period of time. Brake fluid is hygroscopic, meaning it will want to absorb and retain moisture from the ambient environment.

Its from April so no worries. Now if it has been on your shelf for 2 years, I'd pass.

I'd take all 4 for $60.

[EVILUTION]

LOL.... that's only 1% true in terms of what we give a shit about. The #1 thing we should be concerned with is the dry boiling point. Considering we change our fluid almost as often as we put gas in the car our fluid will more than likely never even come close to being considered wet.

I bet you could have an unopened bottle of motul on the shelf for 10 years and it wouldn't accumulate a measurable amount of moisture! Hell even Castrol SRF comes in a plastic bottle.

Companies that sell their shit in metal containers love to use that Tom-foolery to sell their shit but the truth is that it doesn't really matter. The biggest exposer to moisture your fluid will see is from the atmosphere is while its fed into your car. Be sure to keep it sealed as long as possible and to close the brake fluid reservoir (also plastic) as soon as possible.

Fluid is yours if you want it. LMK when you want to get it. I won't be around this weekend so you may want to keep hunting.

[mrslysly]

I can come pick it up tomorrow night. Maybe bring Blaqk and we could meed at politos? Otherwise I'd have to ask andy if he could bring it with him next week.

What are you running that you are selling the motul? SRF?

[EVILUTION]

I'm running Motul. I bought a 10 pack and have used a couple. Motul is nice because it comes in smaller containers. You don't have to waste half a can during a routine purge. I'll be leaving tomorrow night for Reserves but I could drop it off at Dizmms or TKs before I leave. You pay them they pay me.

[northsydryd]

where can you pick up motul? or does it have to be ordered?

[Dizmm]

The #1 thing we should be concerned with is the dry boiling point.


I bet after an auto-x the fluid is half way to the wet boiling point.

[EVILUTION]

I wish I could take that bet but we have no way to test the fluid.

SAE tests have determined that brake fluids in your run of the mill car picks up about 1% of moisture per year.

I order everything online.

If anyone wants some fluid LMK ASAP as I'll be leaving around 8PM.

[Getsideways]

its easy to test fluid actualy they sell test strips just for that

[mrslysly]

Evil, drop the stuff off at andy's or tk's and let me know where. I might be headed to point to pickup some tires from tk's warehouse. Err I mean basement.

[TomKat]

I might be headed to point to pickup some tires from tk's warehouse. Err I mean basement.

No you are bringing a bare 18" rim to see if the tires fit.

[EVILUTION]

its easy to test fluid actualy they sell test strips just for that

Well.... I'm not sure test strips are all that scientific but it would be interesting to perform the test anyway. Do fresh bottle, before event bleed, and after event bleed.

How many bottles of motul do you want?

[mrslysly]

I'd take 4 for $60.

To quote my earlier quote.

[mrslysly]

No you are bringing a bare 18" rim to see if the tires fit.

I would have to see if the rim I have on the car has the same offset as the stock rx8 rims and then bring one of them. If not then I will have to wait for when I need to replace them.

[Dizmm]

I wish I could take that bet but we have no way to test the fluid.

SAE tests have determined that brake fluids in your run of the mill car picks up about 1% of moisture per year.

I could believe that, and it goes right with my statement. Most go through half a set of brake pads at BHF, that’s a few years for a normal car.

Regardless, I had fresh ATE in my car, on street tires, and I’m running about 300whp. It boiled after about 8-9 laps.

[EVILUTION]

^ Pad consumption has nothing to do with moisture. As for the boiling all the means is you over heated your brakes. It has nothing to do with if the fluid was wet or not.

Overheating brakes at BHFs is common and can be expected after 8-9 hard laps especially on street tires.

[EVILUTION]

I'll take 4 for $60

I missed that. But I'm sorry the price is not negotiable.
Maybe someone else can get you some cheaper.

[Dizmm]

^ Pad consumption has nothing to do with moisture.

your right evil, it has a lot to do with heat. the heating and cooling causes moisture.

8 laps at BHF in a near stock evo shouldnt boil fluid. I'm not saying its the fluids fault. I really think its the fault of the shitty brembo brakes the evos come with.

[Getsideways]

I see brake companies say the factory brembos are excellent . BHF is just hell on brakes , and i never wear pads hardly at all there i mightve worn 15% this last time

[EVILUTION]

your right evil, it has a lot to do with heat. the heating and cooling causes moisture.

8 laps at BHF in a near stock evo shouldnt boil fluid. I'm not saying its the fluids fault. I really think its the fault of the shitty brembo brakes the evos come with.


Moisture is either there or it isn't heating and cooling doesn't create moisture.

If I'm not mistaken your car isn't even close to be being near stock. You have a bigger turbo, cams, suspension, wider tires, 3" exhaust, tune, and a half a dozen other little things that after multiple hot laps on a 90* day allow you to push the car beyond it's brake cooling capacity. To top it off before this event you removed your brake cooling duct kit!!!

The stock brembo's are excellent. He's just trying to get you going.

[Dizmm]

heating and cooling doesn't create moisture.

it doesnt? shit what was i thinking. ha,

[Dizmm]

If I'm not mistaken your car isn't even close to be being near stock. You have a bigger turbo, cams, suspension, wider tires, 3" exhaust, tune, and a half a dozen other little things that after multiple hot laps on a 90* day allow you to push the car beyond it's brake cooling capacity. To top it off before this event you removed your brake cooling duct kit!!!

i was on stock like street tires and stock rims.

2in brake ducting isn’t enough to make a difference. go read your 2010 brake thread on evoM, most of the big track guys agree. not to mention the ducts getting snagged on everything and kinking or ripping.

I think some titanium shims would also help for the BHF annual lapping day.

I think Micaiah will have good luck with his new brake setup.



I don’t plan on doing any more track stuff, I think I’m getting too old for this, its just so boring and easy.

[Getsideways]

Ive had TI shims since i bought the car dunno if theve helped or not for sure

[EVILUTION]

I have TI shims as well but they don't fit with new pads.... probably not needed either. I think a 2" duct is the best cooling source available to the average guy.

[SgtRauksauff]

some interesting info from one of the rally forums. I bolded the interesting part.


Brake fluid is one the most important elements of the brake system, so rather buy something cheaper a bleed once per race day.

Also the true boiling points are not what it says on the bottle so dont buy accordingly. We run dyno tests on all types of brake components, pads, discs, calipers, and fluid on a quarterly basis. And of all the "racing" fluids the Castrol SRF is the best hands down with the highest boiling points period. But once it reaches its limit and boils it just doesnt come back and recover like others will, albeit its boiling point is so high that you will most likely be having other problems before the fluid boils. These temps are reached with disc bulk temps of 1300F (with spikes of 2000+) and caliper temps of 450-500. Note that Piston seals start deteriorating at temps that are constantly of over 350F.

Another good and cheap fluid is what some have mentioned here the ATE (blue/gold), its a constant top 10 performer, also a excellent one normally in the top 5 is the Ford heavy duty synth (the metal can version, also available at the dealer). Ask for fluid for a ford focus) Tilton fluids are also very good with a higher vapor lock temps than SRF and they come in 250mm bottles which is perfect so that you always open a fresh bottle.

Others like Motul, Neo, Wilwood, Project Mu, Endless, Brembo, are just back markers and are ok for club racing.

[Dizmm]

^ good find.

I read into that endless stuff, and i dont know if its really new or what, but most still prefer the SRF.

[EVILUTION]

I really don't think fluid is the problem. If both fluids are considered very good like Motul and SRF..... and one fluid has a 600* boil and the next has 660* that means you might get one more hard stop out of the 660* stuff.

Odds are that would have put Dizmm at the end of the front straight when he lost his pedal = high speeds and less run off.

Changing fluid has nothing to do with cooling. If you know you have a brake heat problem changing the fluid does nothing to remove heat. You have to ADD airflow or take a precautionary cool down lap.

It should be noted that running at sustained temps of 500+ also accelerate pad and rotor consumption. The cool down lap will aid in conservation of components and should be considered the best approach.... BTW its free!

[Deadly_Evolution]

^ good find.

I read into that endless stuff, and i dont know if its really new or what, but most still prefer the SRF.

You got any superblue? I need a can.

[EVILUTION]

^ I have some Motul if you are interested (and ST43 brake pads).

[Deadly_Evolution]

Didn't I already say I would take the pads. Will probably take some fluid too.

[SgtRauksauff]

Changing fluid has nothing to do with cooling. If you know you have a brake heat problem changing the fluid does nothing to remove heat.

Exactly. That's my biggest problem, super-significant in my wagon, but very prevalent on my Corolla as well. Super-sticky tires on 13" wheels, and the rotors that fit under them, even going only ~100mph by the end of the straight, get FREAKIN HOT!! And there's such a small area that heat dissipation suffers greatly.

with Higher temp brake fluid, I might be able to do another couple of hard stops, but the heat's going to get to the point that I have to stop using the brakes anyways. I'm just lucky that the toyota's low enough power that I drive it with Conservation of Momentum in mind all the time, and don't rely on brakes overly much. I could probably cut a second or more off of my lap times at BHF, just by being able to use my brakes hard.

We'll see what happens this weekend, I've got my Carbotechs arriving on Thursday...

--sarge

--sarge

[Dizmm]

yes changing fluid has nothing to do with cooling, but it does make for a higher boiling point (unless your downgrading to a cheaper fluid).

[EVILUTION]

Sorry Nick last I heard you were done with the sport. I'll get them ready for pickup!

[Deadly_Evolution]

Well I might give this weekend a shot.. I don't have a fair chance to say if it will or will not be fun till I try out the track.

[EVILUTION]

Do you plan to pick up the pads before Friday? That is fine I just like to plan ahead.

[mrslysly]

Evil, how many bottles of motul do you have left? I was thinking about doing a group buy as I want to pick up enough to last the summer. Hopefully get a discount if we can get enough people interested.

[EVILUTION]

^ I found it hard to get prices down even when you buy 10 at a time. I was able to save a little on shipping and that's it.

I really only have two extra bottles and I think Nick is going to pick one up. The rest I plan to use.

[Dizmm]

check with ebay vendors.

[mrslysly]

^thats the plan. Amazon is pretty competitive too, just have to be careful about those sneaky shipping charges.